Mon, 2008-12-08 07:35 — Thelognoob
Hi Guys
Looing for advice on a trade that will help me become more comfortable with the task of buillding a home. Im totally new to the idea but have been doing a ton of research on this site....would framing be a good foundation to build upon before coming to the class?
Comments
wiring A home
You will need to wind up checking with your local building inspector, but to wire A home is not hard to understand, or accomplish. First of all you will need to know what your building inspector will require you to do before he will pass the home's inspection. And if you can get an electrician to give you some pointers to keep things in spec would save you a lot of wasted time and money. these are ideas for those familiar with electricity and would like to save money by DIY
To give you some heads up I will list A few things that you might consider when planning to wire A new home. with the need to wire in such A way as to keep it modern and up to date. To start I would plan to install A 200 amp service, despite what your current plans are for appliances, heating, ect. down the road you or someone else "new owner" will wish you did. when running the wires from your panel "which is called home runs" I would start with pulling home runs in the list that is below. all 20 amp circuits use #12 wire and 30 amp use #10 wire
-heat - depends on the type you chose if gas you would want a dedicated 20 amp circuit
-A/C -normally dedicated 30 amp 230v
- electric stove dedicated 50 amp 230
-Kitchen you would want A dedicated 20 amp 115v circuits for for all the below items.
fridge
microwave
dishwasher
garbage disposal
freezer
and a separate 20 amp circuit for counter space receptacles with GFI's installed within code distance of
sinks or backed with GFI breakers.
-clothes washer dedicated 20 amp 115v
-dryer dedicated 30 amp 230v
-lights - I would keep on dedicated circuits
-bedrooms- I would keep all bedrooms on there own dedicated 20 amp circuit and backed with arc fault breakers.
-bathrooms all receptacles GFI protected
-fire alarms check with your building inspector, but here in my county each bedroom and one in hallways. these should be on A 20 amp 115v dedicated three wire circuit
- water heater normally dedicated 30 amp 230v
-outside receptacles would be GFI protected
- don't forget lights in attic and crawl space
-dedicated for sump pump 20 amp 115v
- no receptacles in closets and use florescent lights in closets also.
- garage door opener do not back with GFI
-garage receptacles GFI protected
once again these are just sugestions that one with the ability, might want to consider in wiring A new home
arc fault breakers
That's one I dont know arc fault breakers .Jim
arc fault breakers "google"
Summary: Electrical fires happen every day in the United States because of electrical shorts that produce intensely hot arcs. An arc fault circuit interrupter senses these arcs and stops them, making them smarter than traditional circuit breakers
Thank you jim
Thank you jim
Jim: any time. just thought
Jim: any time. just thought maybe A good time for me to jump in on A topic. Brett
Wiring : I got a better way
gonehunting > I got a better way, just offer you a Elk hunt in WY on horses for wiring my home. Of course you could be a guide or already live in Elk country.
HaHa Hey timber I hear that,
HaHa Hey timber I hear that, Hey after all I didn't see any good bucks this year "indiana white tail" and an elk would make for a nice change!
gonehunting
Well best hunt i ever was on was on horses and Elk / And an animal that large you need horses. So when i start my build i will look you up. I have access to a guide and horses. Can get an Elk in one day that you won't forget for the rest of your life. Cody WY. not far from Yellowstone.
My property - Deer
Every time I go to my property, we see some very nice deer. There's a herd of about 20-25 on my land. A hand full of bucks. Earlier, none had horns. Now? OH MY GAWD! Still in velvet and still growing but there are some impressive size muleys. Can't wait for hunting season. Reportedly, Elk come through twice per year.
Big Game
big game in those numbers sounds great, congrats. I'm looking for land and potential for whitetail is a must.
gonehunting
I have land in South Eastern Oregon. Which is Muley country. I've never hunted anything except Muleys in CA before getting this land. It turns out Whitetail are plentiful along the West side of the state. Perhaps I'll learn. You'll have to come and visit. But I warn you, out-of-state licenses and tags are expensive. I don't live there yet. Then there's the "No hunting with horizontal bows." (crossbows) Ouch.
whitetail in western states
You don't here much about whitetails in the western states, I guess with all the other big game whitetails wouldn't rank as high
Whitetail
There used to be lots of whitetail deer in Arizona. Maybe there still is if they haven't been killed off by strip mining and suburban developers.
Off the subject: Insulation
Hi Folks,
I just found a deal on polyisocyanourate foam board insulation. (4x8) Plz see the web site or call Dan for more info.They are factory seconds and Dan at "zinsulation.com" or 801 717-5890 is selling them at 1/4 of retail rate. The foam boards vary in thickness from 1/2 inch to 4 inches. He has some stored in Salt Lake City and some in Grace Idaho.
Plz mention you are from LHBA to get the best deal.
Blondie
common sense
Mon, 2008-12-08 10:28
IMHO.... common sense is really all you need to take this class.
I have a background in mechanical engineering, CAD drafting with side lines in Architecture, civil and lanscaping so i'm quite familair with a few aspects. The way this class is laid out, an taught it is so simple to grasp if you just have some plain old common sense. I took my class directly from Skip, but i'm sure Steve or Skip Jr. teaches things the same way, esp since they learned from the master :) (may he rest in peace)
Beavers build dams - People can build houses
The skills necessary to do home construction and repair can be learned from watching TV shows and books if necessary... it's really not that hard.
Mostly, before I attempt a job 1st time by myself I consult home repair books I purchase at Home Depot and look at instruction pages on the internet, etc. I've watched a lot of "This Old House" and "Hometime" episodes as well.
I'd be the first to admit that I'm slow though! I'm sure it takes me 4 times as long and 3 more trips to the hardware store than a tradesman would take, but it keeps me entertained and I'm only paying for materials and tools. (Tools - the investment that keeps on giving! You do have to store them though!)
I say: If a beaver can build a dam from instinct - I can read a book and build a house. Half of getting any building job done is saying: I can do that! The rest is just figuring out how and learning-by-doing.
I've (mostly) taught myself: framing, finish trim, cabinet hanging, drywall, plumbing, electrical, painting, tiling, concrete work, stair-making. Never discount ditch digging as a skill either. Seems like you never really "own" a place till you've moved every spadefull of dirt on every square inch "from here, to there."
I do think it's important to use the appropriate tool for every job. Don't skimp to much on quality tools. Example: a crappy cheap paint brush can make painting miserable. Must power tools: battery drill driver, Sawsall, and I love my tablesaw for finish work.
But really - "Well begun is half done!" is the best way to approach building skills.
trade
The class teaches you all you need to know about LOG BUILDING. Interior walls will be stud framed. This is not taught. Drywall is not taught, plumbing and electrical are not taught. Complex roofing is not taught. They do teach you novel ways to get skilled help in these areas. If you want to learn a "trade" I may suggest "handyman." You'll need to know how to do most aspects of home construction. Tradesmen are generally very good at doing their trade fast. a skilled framer could likely frame the gable ends and the interior walls in a day. If it takes me a week, it won't be the end of the world. But I should at least have done some of it before (know how to use a level, frame in a doorway, etc. similar with electrical. I'm not particularly fast, but it is only 6 switches and 15 outlets. so what if it takes me a whole day, I can do it.
In short, make sure you know how to do what you'll have to do, but I put limited value on knowing how to do it extremely quickly.
-Peter
I may be biased but . . . .
. . . . . I am going to say residential electrician. (though the company I was employed with was electrical/HVAC/plumbing, so I got all around experience) I was in that field for about eight years, and I'll tell you, you do a little bit of everything. Just a brief list of some of the things I had to do as an electrician: (excluding actual electrical work)
Move studs, and move or add corner ties
Frame in bracing (for ceiling fan boxes or other items)
Plumbing condensate drains and vent lines on heating units
Setting electrical boxes in masonry, involving securing and mortar work
Cabinetry (every once in a while the cabinet guys would cover a wire for a range hood, etc.)
Core drilling masonry and other large masonry protrusions (like gas water heater vent)
Duct/trunk assembly
Ditch and septic tank work
Drywall finishing
Framing isn't a bad idea either, as knowing the details of interior and roof framing will be most helpful, since it's the second least covered subject of the class. (utilities being the first)
Trades
In no particular order. Framing, electrical, plumbing are the three areas that will come into play the most for any building project.
IMO:1. Take the class.2.
IMO:
1. Take the class.
2. If possible, hook up with a LHBA builder in your area and help out through all the phases of construction (from footers to log stacking to finish work).
I am the kinda guy who has to SEE it and then DO IT to learn.
as far as getting employed in a line of work? you may want to figure where you can save the most amount of cash. In other words, what profession will give you the skills to save you the most amount of money?..ie, digging and pouring your own foundation and/piers would save you a boatload. Electrical and plumbing are good trade skills too. I think to learn basic framing (at least for most LHBA homes) is pretty simple but yeah basic carpenter skills are a plus too. Contracting out work is VERY expensive and its often hard to find the good guys. Learning and doing as much as possible by yourself will save you thousands..plus give you bragging rights.
If you have "mucho clamolas" you can subcontract out work but even so, you need to take precautionary measures.
IMO, building a temp living quarters (either a tiny B&P or stickframe house) on your land is a great way to experiment and expose yourself to all phases of building. You can mess around with framing, running electrical, plumbing, roofing, trimwork, drywalling etc and if you screw up? It's no big deal.
Kola
My electrician and plumber
My electrician and plumber were both reluctant to do a log home but were able to do it without much difficulty. These are the two trades that are hardest to hire, therefore the most expensive to hire, for this type of project.
Good point Basil. ...and the
Good point Basil.
...and the class discusses and introduces some cool tips on how to make it all easier (wet wall for plumbing, floor outlets etc)
Kola