Kola,

You may be a little off in your thinking. Although it gets cold back there NY/PA/CO, you were not well prepared. These indians had a lot more animal skins, more fire, and a whole lot of naked indian ladies to keep warm with. *big smile here*

I love your approach. I would have tried it myself. Remember it is better (more noble) to fight and die than to have never fought at all. Or, something like that.

You can not live a life of regrets. Kola gave each of us a good lesson. Get off your duff, and give it a try.

Tom
nobleknight
class 01-15-05

Up in New York the Indians lived in longhouses, not Teepees. If I remember correctly they kind looked like Quanset huts (if anyone here has been in the military, especially over in Sou'east Asia.) Longhouses where made of wood.

My property is restricted that I can't have any "temporary structures" and "no single-wide or double-wide manufactured homes". I'm not sure about a travel trailer though. I could probably do that if it was registered. But I have 4 big dogs. I'm probably going to have to build the garage first with an apartment upstairs. One woman in my class last January said that that was what she and her husband were doing. I camped there last summer for about two weeks and was suprised at how noise carries even when you think you're out in the middle of nowhere. I'm in the foothills of the Adirondack mountains and if at night, a coyote howls in one of those valleys, you can sure hear it. During the day, on the front two pastures, you can hear a car coming for miles. But once you get back into the woods, all you hear are forest noises. Everything else disappears.

I saw a picture in a book of a luxurious lean-to that was built on private property up in the Adirondacks for the owners to live in while they were building their main house. It had all the comforts of home (well, almost...a four poster double bed) in a log lean lean-to. They even had a nice outhouse with an outdoor shower. I could live like that if it backed up to the west. Wouldn't want those horrendous thunderstorm downpours to come in the wide open front! Also, I'd have to sleep with my hand on my shotgun all night.

Frances

Will briefly share our experience. Have 8 acres hardwoods, no money. Living in 30ft 95 travel trailer. Kola right about cost, wrong about insulation. Obviously, they can't put much insulation in them. Maybe new and more expensive models have high density foam, ours is thin fiberglass. Been there 2 years now. Waiting on class and learning about log home building from thie website. It can be done. We are comfortable. Better than expected. Wake up to green woods, birds, coyotes, and walk around nekkid if choose to. (LOL) A deck helped enormously. And wifey missed bath tub so building 155 sq ft bath/laundry/flush toilet building. Building out of donated damaged commercial cooler walls that lock together. Heavily insulated floors and attic, plan to closely monitor energy use. Got by with 300 gal. sewage pumped once per week, but too expensive so put in septic tank. One caution: if you can use open pit toilet, sun heated shower, and wood heat, more power to you and my admiration. We both work, laundry had to be done, ladies need bath tub now and then, these things cost money. And propane is expensive. Our utilities can easily run more than 200 per month in mid-south winters and summers. And we are conservative, let it get so cold gas sensor goes off. Everything on a travel trailer is electronic (fridge, heat, cool, 12v power, everything.) It all breaks, and it is all expensive and sold in narrow market so price is stiff. Still, it works, we may never have log home, but ain't no banker with beady eyes jacking up a "screw you very much" sub prime note on it. One tip I wish I had known earlier: If you decide to use anything with a holding tank type toilet system, BE SURE TO GET SOME "BREWERS YEAST" AND DUMP A CUP OR SO IN IT EACH WEEK. This made a DRASTIC difference for us in living there, without going into disgusting detail You can get it at the Health Food Store. One final note, I've not been to class yet, but advice on going slowly, gathering materials, planning, seems invaluable to me. You would be surprised how quickly you can get taken, spend way too much money, or just do the wrong thing. So far, I have not been able to significantly beat the big box stores on prices, maybe I am not looking in the right places. For example, Craigslist used lighting fixtures at $15 seems cheap, but new ones at Lowes were only 22, with a better lens. Just be careful. And know that everything you try to do will cost more money than you think. But it is working for us, and it can be done. Good luck to all, and good luck to us. Oh yeah. We ain' got no satellite or cable. The hummingbirds entertain us, and DVD's suffice when we just HAVE to have a fix. What a joy to stop that time thief.

I cant testify to living on my land while building, but I have spent about 3-4 years in a camper working in the national forest off and on. the first camper we used was a 12' pop up with slide out beds, we used a couple sheets of blue insulation under the beds to keep the cold out, and we heated with a keresone stove, there was 3-4 of us living in it at any given time, I got the "couch" more like a ledge that had the heater a foot away on one side, and 15 degree Virginia mountain air just a thin piece of canvas away. I learned to roll about every 15 minutes in my sleep, or else I would wake up with my left side burning up, and my right side freezing.
The next camper we got was awesome, its a 20' with a slide out, full kitchen, full bath, a nice couch, and 2 bunks in the back, it has a propane furnace, and a good air conditioner on the top, I think we paid around 15k for it new. it was very comfy, warm, and homey. we lived there for 2 weeks at a time, then home for 4 days, and then back to the camper. a cheap porch would have made it even nicer. my only complaint is the bathroom is very small, and at 6'3, 265lbs, i didnt fit in the shower very well, not to mention the toilet.
I fortunately have a nice home, with a cheap mortgage close to where I will be building my homes, (I plan on selling my first two, then making mine) but if I was living on my land, a nice used camper would def. be my way to go. you buy it, its done, pull it out set it up, and an hour later you can move in, maybe put a porch on it, and by the time you get done trying to improve whatever other method you use, you could have a decent camper already done. maybe not as much "i did it myself" but the same result for alot less effort.

Look, listen and learn
Im Your Huckleberry!
Keep Rocking With Dokken!

Shawn some of use did the tracking on these crates.
If your not close to the docks your screwed becuse to get it to you cost a arm and a leg.
The one i found were well over 1K i thnk more like 2 ore 3.
I was going get one but decided to build a shed was cheeper and i dont like all steal anything